Forged Alliance Forever

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-24T16:36:12+02:00

In teamgames I think it is very strong, especially when you are so close to allies that you can give engies to your ally who made drone to make up for the buildpower loss.
something as simple as having an ally's engie start your hydro, removing the need for the factory would allow you to fix your eco.

Statistics: Posted by Gorton — 24 Dec 2015, 16:36

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-24T11:39:25+02:00

The usefulness of the UEF drone, for the most part, has been rather latent. Because of map makers tastes and preferences moving toward small plateaus separated by steep and impassable terrain. Most of the old GPG maps were careful to preserve pathing. Hence making most reclaim available to ground based reclaiming units.

I don't think UEF drone is a bug, or an exploit. It is a unit functioning as intended. It is also not particularly imbalanced, as the other factions of equally capable ACU upgrades. Futhermore, the opportunity cost includes not only the economic investment into a flimsy unit. But also includes the inability to use the central ACU upgrade slot for any other purpose.

If you consider that AFac + Inty is a high cost for countering. Perhaps you should consider sweetening this investment by building a couple of early air scouts, a bomber. I might also add that if the map features air accessible reclaim, then perhaps you need the AFac anyway to get a transport. Use transport + engie to farm mass.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 24 Dec 2015, 11:39

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T22:44:17+02:00

Well i am pretty sure, this bug is only not fixed cause devs underestimate abuse potential...

I think the reason is that it is part of the bugfix patch, and other changes in the bugfix patch are delaying it. If it were known from the beginning that this other changes would take so long, it would've been smart to split it into two patches, but when the patch release is a week away, you wouldn't split it up. Bad luck if the week becomes two or longer then..

So it has more technical/organisational reasons than an active decision not to fix it fast.

i personally got surprised that no one really abused this for this long

Yeah me too. This needed to be fixed a long time ago, can only learn from that. But it's fixed in beta at least, so it's not that terrible. Maybe its just an attempt to get people to play beta more.

@briang report team killers to the moderators and let them do their job, witch hunting isn't helping.

Statistics: Posted by Zock — 23 Dec 2015, 22:44

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T22:27:11+02:00

Well i am pretty sure, this bug is only not fixed cause devs underestimate abuse potential...
i personally got surprised that no one really abused this for this long

literally everyone is ok with fixing drone, and they are going to fix it
you can't blame people for abusing it, i mean really, cause it is bugged you are not allowed to build that stuff? =\ (hello GPG net times)

happely we are in FAF and shit gets fixed eventually.
if you could survive a direct nuke hit to your ACU by drone abuse, then it would be fixed on next day
(after found that units with personal shield completely invunerable while shield reloads when you powerstall it got fixed in 1-2 days , i remember certain player asking me in PM to not report so quick so he can abuse it a bit)

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 23 Dec 2015, 22:27

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T22:12:48+02:00

I've been calm for a good year+ in this community and have been aggravated by the user base enough.

No more being nice to people. Sorry, ZLO, but there are too many greedy/lustful people who pet their precious rating # in favor of playing the game in friendly, fun competition.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 23 Dec 2015, 22:12

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T22:07:19+02:00

Morax wrote:
Bullshit. Do the math on how much it costs to get an air fact + intie up while walking your comm to get reclaim verse someone who sends a drone after the upgrade. They can get their base and eco established far quicker.

Show me a replay where this isn't the case because I've already played a few games with the drone abuse and after review I can't see a good method to prevent it.

This is just a small bug... it will get fixed, same with t2 shield in gunship, calm down... i also wait for fixes cause i find it painfull to prevent myself from abusing stuff

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 23 Dec 2015, 22:07

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T22:02:01+02:00

Bullshit. Do the math on how much it costs to get an air fact + intie up while walking your comm to get reclaim verse someone who sends a drone after the upgrade. They can get their base and eco established far quicker.

Show me a replay where this isn't the case because I've already played a few games with the drone abuse and after review I can't see a good method to prevent it.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 23 Dec 2015, 22:02

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T20:14:44+02:00

Morax wrote:
ZLO, please look at the replays speed2 and I posted showing multiple people making drones and getting reclaim in team games on a map like Hilly Plateau. You CANNOT possibly get there to build an aa turret to shoot it down and your air player or your own air will be needed to get the drone shot down. The cost to make an air fact and intie >>>>>> drone and the reclaim is pretty much disappearing before you even get there.

This is not a bug, or an exploit. This is a strategy, and as briang will point out, one which has a significant opportunity cost attached.

Only once your Inties arrive and begin not shooting does it cross into the realm of abuse.

Statistics: Posted by IceDreamer — 23 Dec 2015, 20:14

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T19:57:26+02:00

Gorton wrote:
EcoNoob wrote:. Furthermore its not possible for players to see what bugs/abuses are bannable cause lists like these: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1053 are not maintained.

We'll fix this, probably by tomorrow morning.

In the meantime, send anything you know of to the irc mod group - i'm collecting now.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=11322&p=116202

Statistics: Posted by Gorton — 23 Dec 2015, 19:57

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T18:40:35+02:00

ZLO, please look at the replays speed2 and I posted showing multiple people making drones and getting reclaim in team games on a map like Hilly Plateau. You CANNOT possibly get there to build an aa turret to shoot it down and your air player or your own air will be needed to get the drone shot down. The cost to make an air fact and intie >>>>>> drone and the reclaim is pretty much disappearing before you even get there.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 23 Dec 2015, 18:40

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T18:33:50+02:00

Then it loses it sence, if you want people to not use UEF drone, then UEF gets disadvantage cause they can't use drone upgraide.
i just had a game when i wanted to use it and i canceled it cause i wanted to be nice =\ was to lazy to make a transport and my ACU was at t2 so i wanted to use drone, cause i also had air and ACU was close to expansion by air but not close by terrain...

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 23 Dec 2015, 18:33

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T17:44:25+02:00

Ithilis_Quo wrote:
speed2 wrote:You dont need to have 146 IQ to recognize drone use and drone abuse.

I have high enought IQ but still dont know what is differences betwen use and abuse. So be polite and explain me where it is normal use, and where it is abuse?

Of course someone can say, that it is obvious. Abuse it is when its abuse! And thats it! But it isnt. Where its abuse drone?
When i start reclaim enemy main factory its abuse? Or when start reclaim back player reclaim, its abuse and not normal use? And when he didnt recognise it, that something as this is happening, and in most of cause he didnt recognise it, then what is it? Or when enemy dont have interceptor its abuse drone still abuse? or then its not abuse? Build pd with drone is abuse? Seriously what is abuse? And what is use?

In previous time, when drone was destroyed by asf.. When someone will go with asf and destroy bunch of drones, it was abuse asf against drones? Should someone get ban for use asf against drones? Should someone get ban for use asf against drone to destroy shield?

Im 100% sure that none was get ban for use asf against drones, or asf against shield. So please be consistent and dont take any ban for dont autodestroy own drone when see interceptor.

Aai will try to make it as simple as possible, abuse is when you use it.

Statistics: Posted by speed2 — 23 Dec 2015, 17:44

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T16:34:54+02:00

zeroAPM wrote:
Though if some AA units can't hit it due to a bug then i do recognize that it's a problem

it is definitly a problem i fully agree, but it is abuse? Should you ban someone for that?
Its use scout against cybran with T1 AA abuse becsaue reterded AA behavior that is not able shoot scout down ? Did you get ban player that is scouting cybran?

Basicly here exist technical problem,

Spoiler: show

And someone else want to punish players to use unit as before because have another profit from new advantage. That is jast nach.

And i realy dont know what should be judge as normal tricky and creative use, and what as abuse. On my opinion there dont exist any line betwen, and are scary on situation where creative players would be banned becauase creat new strategies and play diferently.

Statistics: Posted by Ithilis_Quo — 23 Dec 2015, 16:34

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T16:17:51+02:00

Abuse is when the filthy turtle faction called Unbelievable Emetic Farthats (UEF for short) is played at all since their presence in the game inevitably grinds it to a halt with horrible, terrible, no good stuff like "shields", "artillery" and "point defences"

Though if some AA units can't hit it due to a bug then i do recognize that it's a problem

Statistics: Posted by zeroAPM — 23 Dec 2015, 16:17

Re: UEF Drone

2015-12-23T16:06:42+02:00

speed2 wrote:
You dont need to have 146 IQ to recognize drone use and drone abuse.

I have high enought IQ but still dont know what is differences betwen use and abuse. So be polite and explain me where it is normal use, and where it is abuse?

Of course someone can say, that it is obvious. Abuse it is when its abuse! And thats it! But it isnt. Where its abuse drone?
When i start reclaim enemy main factory its abuse? Or when start reclaim back player reclaim, its abuse and not normal use? And when he didnt recognise it, that something as this is happening, and in most of cause he didnt recognise it, then what is it? Or when enemy dont have interceptor its abuse drone still abuse? or then its not abuse? Build pd with drone is abuse? Seriously what is abuse? And what is use?

In previous time, when drone was destroyed by asf.. When someone will go with asf and destroy bunch of drones, it was abuse asf against drones? Should someone get ban for use asf against drones? Should someone get ban for use asf against drone to destroy shield?

Im 100% sure that none was get ban for use asf against drones, or asf against shield. So please be consistent and dont take any ban for dont autodestroy own drone when see interceptor.

Statistics: Posted by Ithilis_Quo — 23 Dec 2015, 16:06