Forged Alliance Forever

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-12-31T13:44:36+02:00

pip wrote:
- t1 tank destroyer is very strong, but requires good positioning to be efficient.

The t1 tanks destroyer is what I would currently call "weak", but trust me when I say you don't want to see it when it is "strong".

pip wrote:
- Beamer having issue to shoot : it needs micro to avoid it, like the Monkeylord.

This is an issue that isn't about micro, its the beamer just plain missing the target. You get similar stuff with spiders sometimes though.

Heres a replay of it happening to killhards first beamer against a stationary t1 engineer (no micro)
517920-XBX-DilliDalli.fafreplay

Statistics: Posted by Softly — 31 Dec 2012, 13:44

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-12-31T09:42:43+02:00

Sunny wrote:
Hi, folks!

As for me Nomads are perfect.

Some things need attention in future:
- t3 sub ML is too effective for it's mass (compare to Aeon Torrent)
- t1 tank destroyer doesn't seem to be much of use as it loses to arties in large numbers and is useless in small numbers;
t1 arty also is worse, than other factions'. Mb even more range for tank destroyer would fix both;
- t2 ML fires two rockets, it rapes UEF TMDs;
- some usual for FA bugs, like Beamer missing it's targets, I don't think this is much of priority.

I would just put Nomads straight in ranked. High ranked whinners will just ignore ranked for a patch or two, as they did in past. But the real balance and gameplay issues will hit the surface. Considering the size of comunity, I think, this is the only way to attract enough testers.

Thanks for the great job with Nomads.

Yes, please use the appropriate forum.
- the t3 sub may be adjusted but the torrent ship has 400 DPS, much more range (+50) and above all, each of its missile has 2 hp, the Nomad t3 sub missiles have only 1 hp. It means that cruisers, battleships, carriers, etc that have TMD can defend much more against Nomad t3 sub than against a torrent.
- t1 tank destroyer is very strong, but requires good positioning to be efficient.
- t2 MML are efficient, but not much more than Cybran ones to overcome UEF TMD.
- Beamer having issue to shoot : it needs micro to avoid it, like the Monkeylord.

Statistics: Posted by pip — 31 Dec 2012, 09:42

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-12-31T00:32:39+02:00

go here epic necromat
viewforum.php?f=17

also: without replay proving your stament your point of view will not be considered

Statistics: Posted by ColonelSheppard — 31 Dec 2012, 00:32

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-12-31T00:26:37+02:00

Hi, folks!

As for me Nomads are perfect.

Some things need attention in future:
- t3 sub ML is too effective for it's mass (compare to Aeon Torrent)
- t1 tank destroyer doesn't seem to be much of use as it loses to arties in large numbers and is useless in small numbers;
t1 arty also is worse, than other factions'. Mb even more range for tank destroyer would fix both;
- t2 ML fires two rockets, it rapes UEF TMDs;
- some usual for FA bugs, like Beamer missing it's targets, I don't think this is much of priority.

I would just put Nomads straight in ranked. High ranked whinners will just ignore ranked for a patch or two, as they did in past. But the real balance and gameplay issues will hit the surface. Considering the size of comunity, I think, this is the only way to attract enough testers.

Thanks for the great job with Nomads.

Statistics: Posted by Sunny — 31 Dec 2012, 00:26

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-03-22T10:22:08+02:00

This last message from Brute means that Nomads need help in 2 areas in order to progress:
- modelers who can do models from scratch (and not model hacker)
- texturers
(or someone who can do both).

If anyone is seriously interested, he should contact Brute51 via PM. Without support, Brute will have to do everything, and it will take a very long time before Nomads can be finished.

Statistics: Posted by pip — 22 Mar 2012, 10:22

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-04T20:36:45+02:00

Look, the current version of Nomads on FAF is far from complete and dont mean just the models. There really are plenty of (semi) obvious bugs in it. The textures of the units differ much from each other, there is no clear theme making the units look incoherent. If it's up to me the current version will not be made public (open beta or otherwise). I've learned from the 2 tries to start up a (closed) test; in the current situation this open test period you appearantly are so eager to start won't go well. 'We' have one shot to make Nomads known and popular among the community. If we take that shot now it'll fail for sure. Adding even more UEF placeholder models is only going to make it worse.
The ones who currently have access to Nomads on FAF can play it and that will not change. Their feedback is greatly appreciated and please keep it coming. Meanwhile the team continues to work on the project. Updates will come and we'll see what happens once it's sufficiently matured.

Statistics: Posted by Brute51 — 04 Feb 2012, 20:36

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-04T19:03:44+02:00

The nomads miss only very few units, like the SCU(which are not important anyway) and all units (except the t3 mmd) which are implemented have models and textures and just need to be debugged.

Seriously, they have more units than Seraphim! You can still add units after they are released, but to write that they can not be released, because they have to few units finished is just bullshit.

EDIT:

MushrooMars wrote:
At that, I can't even get my hands on an importer/exporter because all the links are shot.

Here are the last import/export scripts for blender, I found. They work with Blender version 2.49 and below.

Exporter:
http://www.mediafire.com/?dtzk8o1scfq9496
Supcom2 Importer (Can not import fa .sca)
http://www.mediafire.com/?zv8wpkq6ixkndi5

Statistics: Posted by Karottenrambo — 04 Feb 2012, 19:03

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-04T17:24:27+02:00

FunkOff wrote:
MushrooMars wrote:the Nomads still have a whole lot of work to do.

...And nobody to do it. I'm not saying I can make the Nomads every bit as awesome as they were originally intended/envisioned. What I can do, however, is make them into something, because right now, with nobody playing them and nobody working on them, they are nothing.

Funk, unlike you, the dev team doesn't have time to make models and troubleshoot broken .bp files all day. I have to humor my school, and everyone else on the dev team either has a job or school to go to as well.

If you want to make a bunch of high-quality, original models and textures and send them in, feel free.

However, at the moment, you are not doing anything. I will gladly admit I am new to the FA scene when it comes to modding, I barely have an idea how to rig a boat after all, but I am at least getting something done. At that, I can't even get my hands on an importer/exporter because all the links are shot.

Honestly, what would you do in our situation? Crank out a bunch of 500-poly models and be done with it? No, we want to be thorough with the mod.

Statistics: Posted by MushrooMars — 04 Feb 2012, 17:24

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-02T14:32:20+02:00

pip wrote:
I would never play a faction with placeholder / untextured models more than once or twice, just to test it.
It has to be finished first. If no modeller and texturer finishes the job, the mod will just remain unfinished, and balanced or not, players won't play with it seriously.

pip and I seem to have found something that we agree on.

I would rather see it done right than released half-posteriored.

Statistics: Posted by uberge3k — 02 Feb 2012, 14:32

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-02T08:54:39+02:00

I would never play a faction with placeholder / untextured models more than once or twice, just to test it.
It has to be finished first. If no modeller and texturer finishes the job, the mod will just remain unfinished, and balanced or not, players won't play with it seriously.

Statistics: Posted by pip — 02 Feb 2012, 08:54

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-02T05:59:40+02:00

MushrooMars wrote:
the Nomads still have a whole lot of work to do.

...And nobody to do it. I'm not saying I can make the Nomads every bit as awesome as they were originally intended/envisioned. What I can do, however, is make them into something, because right now, with nobody playing them and nobody working on them, they are nothing.

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 02 Feb 2012, 05:59

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-02-02T05:26:55+02:00

FunkOff wrote:
Brute51 wrote:If you ask me, Nomads is in alpha phase because it still needs a lot of work and that isn't just tweaking the balance. Alpha testing can't be finished cause the alpha stage isn't completed.
A lot of units still need proper models (for example the shield structures, SCU, gateway and one or two missing units). Even more need a new texture. So yeah, a large chunk of the work is in the "art" area.

No offense, but I can personally do all the work required to make Nomads complete with only the data that I have so far. I can replace the UEF battleship with the Dreadnaught (properly balanced, of course) and just use a larger version of the tech 2 sonar model for the tech 3 sonar one.... and find another model to use for the TMD.

Okay, let me clarify some things for you Funk...
1. Brute only listed a few bits of the artwork that are missing, a few others are the T2 torpedo boat, a model for orbital drop, a model for the T2 transport, the SCU... The list literally goes on.
2. Even more textures are missing. I'm pretty sure both the shield generators and their stealth counterparts have missing textures, an experimental has a missing texture, and a few others I can't name off the top of my head. Also, textures have to be done for all the models yet to come.
3. We can't simply 'drop in' models, the Nomads have their own unique art style, and it would look unpleasant to simply scale up and scale down models and throw them into other folders. That would be used for a placeholder at the most, and even then, it's not really worth the trouble.
4. 'Finding' models is also out of the question, as again, the Nomads have their own unique art style, and it could infringe on copyright.

I don't represent the entire team when I say these things, they are my sole opinion, but the Nomads still have a whole lot of work to do. Also, I'm not looking to start an argument with the all-mighty FunkOff, I'm just stating facts.

Statistics: Posted by MushrooMars — 02 Feb 2012, 05:26

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-01-31T07:05:47+02:00

Brute51 wrote:
If you ask me, Nomads is in alpha phase because it still needs a lot of work and that isn't just tweaking the balance. Alpha testing can't be finished cause the alpha stage isn't completed.
A lot of units still need proper models (for example the shield structures, SCU, gateway and one or two missing units). Even more need a new texture. So yeah, a large chunk of the work is in the "art" area.

No offense, but I can personally do all the work required to make Nomads complete with only the data that I have so far. I can replace the UEF battleship with the Dreadnaught (properly balanced, of course) and just use a larger version of the tech 2 sonar model for the tech 3 sonar one.... and find another model to use for the TMD.

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 31 Jan 2012, 07:05

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-01-31T07:03:26+02:00

Kryo wrote:
ok lets say we wait for them to be better balanced and finished...

1. who is doing the work?

2. who is balancing it?

These are two essential points. Unfortunately, it appears as there is nobody doing the work for either. I'd gladly do #2 if allowed....

Statistics: Posted by FunkOff — 31 Jan 2012, 07:03

Re: What ought be done with the Nomads?

2012-01-28T13:23:23+02:00

FunkOff wrote:
pip wrote:Yeah, I think it's necessary to do some alpha testing to fix most bugs and blattant imbalances before releasing a more widely spread beta version.

Alpha testing has been done, fixing most bugs and imbalances has been done. (You're welcome.)

And if Brute needs a texturer and modeller, it means not all units are finished.

I think all but 2 units are finished... the battleship (using the UEF model atm) and the tech 3 sonar... but seraphim does just fine without a tech 3 sonar so it's hardly a big deal.

If you ask me, Nomads is in alpha phase because it still needs a lot of work and that isn't just tweaking the balance. Alpha testing can't be finished cause the alpha stage isn't completed.
A lot of units still need proper models (for example the shield structures, SCU, gateway and one or two missing units). Even more need a new texture. So yeah, a large chunk of the work is in the "art" area.

Statistics: Posted by Brute51 — 28 Jan 2012, 13:23