Forged Alliance Forever

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-13T01:39:44+02:00

PhilipJFry wrote:
You don't know what you're doing

Basically this thread
im about to write the whole thing off as trolling

Statistics: Posted by biass — 13 Jul 2016, 01:39

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T17:31:35+02:00

The Novax is a fairly weak unit that will be stopped by some shields and some build power.
The only reasons why anyone would build one imho are:
- Swag
- You don't know what you're doing
- You ctrl+k sats over an smd/paragon/mavor/yolo

Statistics: Posted by PhilipJFry — 12 Jul 2016, 17:31

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T17:23:24+02:00

biass wrote:
and as you said you need lots to make a difference,

You only need lots to win with them, even a single novax can make a difference, because:

biass wrote:
i would only make novax to piss off air player

They're annoying! That is useful in and of itself, no one likes to have one of those stupid sats buzzing around. It's the same principle as raids with any other unit, you can distract and frustrate your opponent. It is annoying to have to pop up shields everywhere, and even more annoying when that novax you've been ignoring is suddenly killing stuff when you power stall and you can't get new shields up in time because there are no engis around, bumper cars, etc.

biass wrote:
other stuff can do it better

Yeah, like what? Strats? Drops? Those units have a lot more potential to do damage, definitely, but they also require attention to use, because they risk being destroyed and you risk providing reclaim to your opponent. Other than those, what UEF units can harass and do damage out further than 150 range from the waterline, starting from before you've even finished naval cleanup? Not to mention what if your opponent builds a scathis?

I'm not saying they're super powerful (and I don't know how this conversation about winning navy with sats got started, because that's silly), but a Novax is certainly more useful than three extra BS with nothing in range or a fatty that can't get in range without being blown up. Also, people keep talking like they're really expensive, but they're really not. Three Continentals with Percies or a dozen strats cost the same as a Novax. If you haven't won the air game, which would you rather have? (Obviously you're not going to say a sat but you get my point.)

Oh, and I'm not talking about setons specifically either, I'm talking about any of these stalemate maps that are so popular on faf - setons, wonder, canis, etc. Certainly if I'm playing on Roanoake or sera glaciers or some other real naval map like that, a sat is unlikely to make an appearance.

BushMaster wrote:
The real problem with the novax is that any time a balance change is suggested to it, along with other balance changes a person suggests in the same thread, 99% of the talk is about the novax.... Show the other suggestions some love guys

That's because Novax is super cool and unique, and just more interesting to talk about than the other units. Also, people don't use it, so they don't understand its awesome sex appeal.

Statistics: Posted by Mycen — 12 Jul 2016, 17:23

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T09:45:29+02:00

BushMaster wrote:
The real problem with the novax is that any time a balance change is suggested to it, along with other balance changes a person suggests in the same thread, 99% of the talk is about the novax.... Show the other suggestions some love guys
Also novax is already op on 81km maps sooooo....

...With the exception that it takes half a day to get anywhere.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 12 Jul 2016, 09:45

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T09:41:49+02:00

The real problem with the novax is that any time a balance change is suggested to it, along with other balance changes a person suggests in the same thread, 99% of the talk is about the novax.... Show the other suggestions some love guys
Also novax is already op on 81km maps sooooo....

Statistics: Posted by BushMaster — 12 Jul 2016, 09:41

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T09:16:23+02:00

Hawkei wrote:
How about giving the Novax the ability to shoot air targets? Say for instance if you make it capable of shooting down Transport and gunship class air units, it might actually make it useful as a "defence satellite".

Without buffing its speed to track transports, it wouldn't be very effective at this. And if you buff it enough to be effective against air units, then it becomes that much harder to snipe the Novax building. Novax needs more counters. Otherwise you can't buff it without making it OP, and it's not worth using without a buff.

Statistics: Posted by zolikk — 12 Jul 2016, 09:16

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T09:05:51+02:00

LichKing2033 wrote:
briang wrote:Novax is fine where it is. I don't see many buffs that can be made without making it too strong. The clear disadvantage to the mavor is the transit times to targets and between them. It is incredibly easy to react to compared to the mavor. Novax crawls to its next target while mavor adjusts for a second or so and begins firing.

This is the exact reason Novax has to be changed. It is too easy to react to. This is why it needs either a serious cost decrease or a serious buff of abilities, like super-intel, which is what Ithilis and Gorton proposed. Right now, Novax is a f**ked up experimental that is nowhere. It's not artillery, not air unit, not land unit. Not navy unit either. And not an experimental SML.

How about giving the Novax the ability to shoot air targets? Say for instance if you make it capable of shooting down Transport and gunship class air units, it might actually make it useful as a "defence satellite".

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 12 Jul 2016, 09:05

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T08:51:26+02:00

thats 3 omen class battleships

and as you said you need lots to make a difference, thus even more battleships

i would only make novax to piss off air player when i killed my mirror with, battleships

and ofc, other stuff can do it better

Statistics: Posted by biass — 12 Jul 2016, 08:51

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T08:47:49+02:00

biass wrote:
Sentons regulars = know nothing about navy, all trolls

rip

also if you have 29k mass to put in novax to deny something you have 29 k mass to put into navy, win it, and they wont have what you're denying because they would be dead

Yeah, because if real players are playing a 29k mass difference is a game-deciding amount.

Statistics: Posted by Mycen — 12 Jul 2016, 08:47

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T06:27:53+02:00

Sentons regulars = know nothing about navy, all trolls

rip

also if you have 29k mass to put in novax to deny something you have 29 k mass to put into navy, win it, and they wont have what you're denying because they would be dead

Statistics: Posted by biass — 12 Jul 2016, 06:27

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T06:25:00+02:00

So absolutely everyone on this forum is a troll?

Statistics: Posted by Mel_Gibson — 12 Jul 2016, 06:25

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T06:37:35+02:00

...
I can see how you'd rather have three BS and a shield than a Novax when fighting a naval battle. (Especially when your opponent's air is smashing you with T3 torp bombers ) But his point about sniping cruisers with sats is a good one. Three BS are obviously not better for removing your opponents cruisers (well, not if they're UEF, obviously) than a Novax, because with BS you have to beat the opposing navy to get to the cruisers, whereas the sat just flies right over it.

But what about when you are the one who won the wreck field? You have to dump that mass into something,... Novax isn't a bad choice here.

You guys can talk shit about how useless a single Novax is, but remember, they're like Pringles - you never stop at just one...

Sigh... You don't build a Novax for the purpose of denying reclaim or destroying build power. That's something you do with the Novax while your are accumulating them. And it is something the sat is actually pretty decent at...

Finally! Someone gets it.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 12 Jul 2016, 04:55

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-12T06:41:22+02:00

(double post)

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 12 Jul 2016, 04:55

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-11T20:38:09+02:00

LichKing2033 wrote:
Gonna have to go with Ben on this one. Novax has too few uses and a cost equivalent to a fatboy. Yes, it is indestructible unless you kill the center but currently I'd rather have 3 battleships and a shield rather than a Novax, be it setons or any other map. This was the reason I started this thread.

I can see how you'd rather have three BS and a shield than a Novax when fighting a naval battle. (Especially when your opponent's air is smashing you with T3 torp bombers ) But his point about sniping cruisers with sats is a good one. Three BS are obviously not better for removing your opponents cruisers (well, not if they're UEF, obviously) than a Novax, because with BS you have to beat the opposing navy to get to the cruisers, whereas the sat just flies right over it.

But what about when you are the one who won the wreck field? You have to dump that mass into something, and you don't need more ships - what then? Sure, you could start a T3 arty, but it will take a long time to build, and can't reach the stuff on the map that's really important. On the other hand, you could start a few Novax, and not only will they be dealing damage before the arty is ready, but nothing will be out of range, and you can accurately hit anything you want without it being able to hide from you. Also, if you are in situations where it is hard to press your naval advantage because of defensive nukes, you'll want to do something besides more ships. Novax isn't a bad choice here.

You guys can talk shit about how useless a single Novax is, but remember, they're like Pringles - you never stop at just one...

BenDover wrote:
Navax seems like a very expensive way to deny reclaim when there are other ways of getting it (2 scus can clear large reclaim fields rather quickly), and there are far better uses for it than sniping engies.

Sigh... You don't build a Novax for the purpose of denying reclaim or destroying build power. That's something you do with the Novax while your are accumulating them. And it is something the sat is actually pretty decent at, more so than a few BS that are busy trying to fight an enemy navy...

Statistics: Posted by Mycen — 11 Jul 2016, 20:38

Re: SMD/SML, Novax and Quantum Gates

2016-07-11T18:44:25+02:00

Gonna have to go with Ben on this one. Novax has too few uses and a cost equivalent to a fatboy. Yes, it is indestructible unless you kill the center but currently I'd rather have 3 battleships and a shield rather than a Novax, be it setons or any other map. This was the reason I started this thread.

Statistics: Posted by Lieutenant Lich — 11 Jul 2016, 18:44