Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Pamnal

2018-05-26T02:32:09+02:00

v0060
complete marker rework
thx to the help of Uveso ai on 20x20 version should perform much better
removed walls from default settings

v0060
small heigtmap changes

v0061
complete marker rework with hazardx markereditor

v0062
terrain tuning all over the place

v0063
imroved ai pathing

v0064
hotfix p7/p8 base ramp too steep

v0065
changed topmost/bottom hill to plateaus
added ramps to islelands
imroved ai pathing

v0066
changes to hill infront of p3/p4
changes to hill infront of p1/p2
changes to p3/4/5/6 Base related to
balance and ai getting stuck

v0067
terrain tuning all over the place
imroved ai pathing trickery

v0068
terrain tuning all over the place
imroved ai pathing trickery
fixed some props
fixed pathways where they shouldnt be any

v0069
increased buildspace for cornerplayers
added ramps to p5/p6 base
reduced bloom by half
fixed some props
heightmap and marker finetuning
imroved ai pathing trickery

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 26 May 2018, 02:32

Re: Pamnal

2018-03-29T18:11:14+02:00

Hey Egon,

The pathdebugging is not an ingame function. I programmed this to debug the pathfinding for my own AI.

You have to wait until i release my AI.
It has the pathdebugging function included. Then you can simply activate this with a lobbyoption.

Will be look like this:
PathfindingOption.png
I am always testing with +10 gamespeed. Mostly the speed will drop to +6 on endgame.

I would expect a max gamespeed of +2 on a 20x20 map with 2 AIs and 500 units for each AI.
No worry, the Ai will not do any mistakes on different gamespeeds.
(The game would desync because of a wrong checksum if this would happen)

Maybe the speed drop is because the AI is now producing more units since it can send units faster to the enemy because of better pathing.

Statistics: Posted by Uveso — 29 Mar 2018, 18:11

Re: Pamnal

2018-03-29T17:09:12+02:00

hi cookie, instuctions in vid and textfile are clear.
one point that needs updating in the vid was that the upload scipt now handles "local Tables = import('/maps/mapname/mapname_tables.lua')" on its own.
got almost crazy when trying to change the code to associate army_1 and army_5 as pairs for example. but thats me not being a coder.
what i meant was, that it is hard to find a link to your tutorial. for what its worth this should be its own thread and pinned in mapping or sth.
i only found it after watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kgq89jO1zg&t=1343s. which was linked somewhere.
maybe iam just too stupid to use forum search correctly, which is always a possibility.
never saw that wiki article, tbh i completely forgot about it around 2014 since it was not rly maintained.
also i would like to name my maps adaptive when:
1. all regular adaptive features are integrated and tested
2. i am happy with the quality
3. someone is willing and able to delete the old ones

lastly ty for all that work, handling the old resources script was most horrid. love that tables_lua.

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 29 Mar 2018, 17:09

Re: Pamnal

2018-03-29T15:37:13+02:00

Egon wrote:
the reason u find the code so beautiful is because it was not done by me instead it was made by Cookienoob and
Keyblue which i credit in the map description. Its their adaptive map script which indeed is awesome but hard to find info on.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVxEhCuc53g

hey Egon, really nice to see more and more mappers use the adaptive map script! What kind of information do you think is missing? When I made the video, I tried to make it short and still explain all necessary steps to use the functions that the script provides. The wiki article about adaptive maps could probably be extended, but I am not that active lately. I do respond to PMs (here on the forum or on slack) though and I get a notification when someone posts in the adaptive map forum topic viewtopic.php?f=53&t=13014 . So in case you still need informations about how stuff works (which seems unlikely), just send me a message

The map looks very nice... I would definetely be playing it (if I would still play xD). Did you ever think about renaming it to Adaptive Panmal?

Statistics: Posted by CookieNoob — 29 Mar 2018, 15:37

Re: Pamnal

2018-03-29T14:49:31+02:00

hi Uveso, thx for taking ur time to do this. bad news are good news in this case.
was about to ask you to do this anyhow, saw u doing this on the other thread.
the reason u find the code so beautiful is because it was not done by me instead it was made by Cookienoob and
Keyblue which i credit in the map description. Its their adaptive map script which indeed is awesome but hard to find info on.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVxEhCuc53g
how do u debug ai like that, iam super interested in that Process! i only know about ctrl+alt+p (debug navpath).
which kind of ai are u using?
when playing with 2-3 friends vs 5 ai i get totally different behavior which makes debugging even harder.

did alot of testing so far, cant exactly reproduce shown behavior but it seems ai improved alot thx to your input.
i added more marker/shorter distance/different pathing away from hills and water and removed any amphibious marker on or near water.
still holding back because simspeed seems to be worse now and i discovered more things that might be related.
iam under the impression ai makes "mistakes" when gamespeed gets too high, what are ur thoughts on this?
do u test on normal +0 speed?

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 29 Mar 2018, 14:49

Re: Pamnal

2018-03-27T14:58:54+02:00

Hello Egon,

i saw you updating this topic and at the same time i was looking for a new map to test some AI stuff.

Well, here i am

First of all all i like the shape of our map. (talking about Pamnal v59)
Could be an awesome human versus AI map!

After viewing the new options and the surprising map wellcome message (report errors to Egon - hehe nice) i was already amazed
I am also always interested in coding and took a look at your scripts.
Really nice coding, clean array formating and many remarks. I like that.
I also spyed at the remarked code. Maybe i saw the next updates there?

Now the bad news :/
There was a warning from my mapvalidator:

Code:: WARNING: * ValidateMapAndMarkers: adjacentTo is empty in marker [AmphPN30] - MarkerType: ['Amphibious Path Node']. - Pathmarker must have an adjacent marker for pathing.

This will not crash the game. The pathing function can handle this.
But your map instructed me to report this

Also the pathmarkers and connections are not on the right place.
The AI has trouble to find paths to it's destination:

Pamnal.png
In case they are not finished;
I can't wait for the finished map to test and surely play it!

If not, can you make markers that look like this?:

Pamnalpath.png
Overall a very good map!

Statistics: Posted by Uveso — 27 Mar 2018, 14:58

Re: Pamnal

2018-03-23T13:11:31+02:00

v0047
work on stratums
fixed some decals
added some more rocks for reclaim

v0048
much heightmap tuning
moved mexes out of starterbases to counter turtling

v0049
changed center again

v0050
script hotfix

v0051
changes to stratums
moved some mexes around

v0052
fixed waves
changes to main hills
moved some other mexes around
reduced overall hight difference below 50

v0053
reclaim balance
finetuning
added mexes

v0054
fixes to reclaim
heightmap fixes

v0055 Beta 10 Milestone "Para Bellum"
big changes to center player base
fixed markers

v0056
changes to player bases
work on decals
props
heightmap balance

v0057
added reclaim wrecks (default enabled)
added first civ buildings
both adjustable
fixed waves
p10 possible bug
decals cutoff
balance and bias

v0058
improved convexity generation
added more marker for 20x20
improved ai behavior on 20x20

v0059
complete rework of props/reclaim
improved props layout and composition
reduced count and increased amount
fixed p4/5 startpos was off by some grids

Pics:

Spoiler: show

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 23 Mar 2018, 13:11

Re: Pamnal

2018-02-04T09:39:08+02:00

v0032
hydro fixe for p10

v0033
switched to faf map editor by ozonex
mayor terrain changes all over the place
fixed some impassable terrain
more focus on north vs south
balanced mexes
removed redundant markers

v0034
hotfix.

v0035
fixed army spawn ids

v0036 beta 8 Milestone "AntiDogma"
complete rebuild
added awesome new adaptive script by cookienoob

v0037
changed water visuals
added much more reclaim to the map(35k mass total)
changed mex layout

v0038
adjustable reclaim/mexes/hydros
regrowing trees (default disabled)

v0039
hotfix
release Pamnal mini

v0040
fixed placeholder trees
some work on decals
changed ai to fight diagonally
more finetunig markers
fix center puddles not deep enough to submerge com

v0041
fixed shortcuts leading into some starter bases

v0042 Beta9 Milestone "Nemesis"
complete marker rebuild with hazardx marker editor
fixed map not displaying as AI Markers:YES in lobby
ai should be much stronger now

v0043
version unifying
defined crazy rush mexes

v0044
mayor Terrain Updates
fixed missing adaptive map flag
made ramps more visible

v0045
further simplyfying.
drastically reduced hill hight and complexity.
opend up waterway somewhat, investing in naval is less risky RoI wise
fixed 2mex while listening to 2mex https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ax0SKoCwiVU

v0046
moved convex stratum above sand
fixed sand stratum
fixed water lvl too high, causing clipping
some work on stratum transition
added some decals
added waves

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 04 Feb 2018, 09:39

Re: Pamnal

2018-01-06T00:32:52+02:00

v024
simplyfied Terrain

v025 Beta6 Milestone "Atlantis"
Map ~75% done
much love for naval
reworked Water

v026

v027
reworked Playerbases

v028
big changes to center again

v029

v0030
Beta7 Milestone "Hamburger Hill"
Map ~80% done
finalized Big Hills/Center Hills
more reclaim balance
added mexes and moved some around

v0031
too many mex spawn fix

Could someone delete all Pamnal maps from the Vault pls. I cant PM ppl as it throws errors. Will maintain only 2 versions in the Future...promise.

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 06 Jan 2018, 00:32

Re: Pamnal

2016-02-21T16:20:34+02:00

If you are still working with this, there is one 5v5 replay from mini version (because online replay vault is broken). I liked the map, almost all tech levels were used and there was lots of early figthing before t3 stage.

Statistics: Posted by seero — 21 Feb 2016, 16:20

Re: Pamnal

2015-12-19T11:40:21+02:00

EP - Extended Play

Statistics: Posted by speed2 — 19 Dec 2015, 11:40

Re: Pamnal

2015-12-19T10:41:33+02:00

also whats EP?

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 19 Dec 2015, 10:41

Re: Pamnal

2015-12-19T10:41:00+02:00

hi speed ty for ur feedback as always, looking forward for ur evaluation. Abaut the Vault Clutter, i tried to contact sheeo asking him to delete every map prior to b3. But still no reaction after 1 month. Ultimatively i would prefer to have only 2-3 maps in the vault (Pamnal/Pamnal mini/Pamnal dev). The 3vs3 and 5vs5 was an accident prior i got knowledge of that awesome ressource script. i too would like tho solve that mess, but there is also a bit of a dilemma in finding a Final Solution: i didnt really play FA for Years beside some LAN Games with the Friends. i dont got any "high profile" replays necessary for quality-controling my map beside 1 Game seero did. Sheo didnt react to my delete Request. The beta Patch notes of 3652 got sth in them that suggested a fix for the Vault Issue (not beeing able to search for replays of updated maps), however i didnt find a link to the beta Lobby neither an ETA.

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 19 Dec 2015, 10:41

Re: Pamnal

2015-12-19T03:19:53+02:00

I think there is one thing you should try to avoid. If someone searches for your map and find this it's not very good:

That gives no idea what to download, unneccessary polution of map vault. I guess you wanted 4 version right? 3v3 and 5v5 for both 10,20 km.

Best solution would be to have 4 maps called like this: Pamnal, Pamnal EP, Pamnal Mini, Pamnal Mini EP. Either EP or 5v5 to let everyone know its for more players. I personally prefer EP instead of numbers in map name, but that's up to you.

I was looking at the mini version a bit, will get some feedback with screenshots soon.

Statistics: Posted by speed2 — 19 Dec 2015, 03:19

Re: Pamnal

2015-12-18T19:44:47+02:00

wanted to elaborate on 3 things:
terrain is ruff in some places on purpose to make indirect fire more useful and help with com survival(creating an imbalance between races would be more of a concern).
to compensate for the large amount of erosion i rely 100% on Textures generated from the hightmap so one can spot them from afar (i dislike fake optics bigtime, everthing should be as u see it)
the 2 big hills should function as a divider for airspace also they are offcenter/counterclockwise/counter land-attack-direction on purpose (i.a. preventing player 1/6 from supporting land-advance onto Hill with air).
when playing 2vs2 west vs east, make sure that 2 of the players start diagonally.
not wanting to be dogmatic here, always thankful for constructive critique.

funfact: there are 8 times more germans visiting here than any other nationality

v0023
complete rework of map center
removed more erosion to give Players 2/4/7/9 more flat terrain
increased size of the 3 main gaps by 15-20%, thx to seero
further work on v22 Balcony
tuned water depth
brought back black map boarder in attempt to fix air bugs
ai marker fixes

Pics:

Spoiler: show

Statistics: Posted by Egon — 18 Dec 2015, 19:44