Forged Alliance Forever Forged Alliance Forever Forums 2016-08-11T17:18:15+02:00 /feed.php?f=62&t=12906 2016-08-11T17:18:15+02:00 2016-08-11T17:18:15+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132626#p132626 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> off forums and into get gud instead pls

Statistics: Posted by biass — 11 Aug 2016, 17:18


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2016-08-11T17:01:27+02:00 2016-08-11T17:01:27+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132625#p132625 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>
Hawkei wrote:
my landfac buildorder is

1 scout
20 engineers


Well that's just stupid. For several reasons. You have no land units, no defensive units, and no raiding units to apply immediate pressure - and immediate pressure is exactly what you should be doing against a bomber first type build.

Okay, the scenarios where you are likely to see a bomber are as follows:

1. 1st Air Bomber
He will do Pgen, Afac, Bomber... This results in an extremely early bomber, and you will likely only have 5 units and one factory operational.

2. 2nd Air Bomber
He will do Lfac, 2 Pgen, 2 Mex, 4 Pgen, Afac, Bomber... This is the more usual arrival time, and this is more popular with most players. As it allows for decent ground expansion and is a good compromise.

In either of these cases, you should IMMEDIATELY stop whatever it is you thought you were doing and take the following actions simultaneously:
- Build an Interceptor if you have an air factory;
- Build 2 or more T1 MAA from the land factory;
- Build static AA in your base with ACU; and
- Send all your land units to attack his expansion points (because he is very likely to have undefended engineers).

Now the first problem is that if you are letting him kill all your engineers, power, and storage, you are not adapting to the situation. Early bomber is an imminent threat. You must deal with it immediately. The second problem is that you are ill equipped to counter attack, because, you have no aggressive ground units of any kind.


i wasnt playing 1v1, i mean teamgames on small maps without giant mass dumps that are needed to fight for.

Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 17:01


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2016-08-11T17:02:41+02:00 2016-08-11T17:00:04+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132624#p132624 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>

my landfac buildorder is

1 scout
20 engineers


Well that's just stupid. For several reasons. You have no land units, no defensive units, and no raiding units to apply immediate pressure - and immediate pressure is exactly what you should be doing against a bomber first type build.

Okay, the scenarios where you are likely to see a bomber are as follows:

1. 1st Air Bomber
He will do Pgen, Afac, Bomber... This results in an extremely early bomber, and you will likely only have 5 units and one factory operational.

2. 2nd Air Bomber
He will do Lfac, 2 Pgen, 2 Mex, 4 Pgen, Afac, Bomber... This is the more usual arrival time, and this is more popular with most players. As it allows for decent ground expansion and is a good compromise.

In either of these cases, you should IMMEDIATELY stop whatever it is you thought you were doing and take the following actions simultaneously:
- Build an Interceptor if you have an air factory;
- Build 2 or more T1 MAA from the land factory;
- Build static AA in your base with ACU; and
- Send all your land units to attack his expansion points (because he is very likely to have undefended engineers).

Now the first problem is that if you are letting him kill all your engineers, power, and storage, you are not adapting to the situation. Early bomber is an imminent threat. You must deal with it immediately. The second problem is that you are ill equipped to counter attack, because, you have no aggressive ground units of any kind.

***

Also, interceptors are very good at taking out bombers. But to do this you actually need to get them out there and "intercept". This means air scouts, radar coverage, and air patrols to establish a perimeter so that bombers cannot touch you. You can have all the interceptors in the world, but, if they are parked on the deck they are not controlling your airspace and will do you no good.

Statistics: Posted by Hawkei — 11 Aug 2016, 17:00


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2016-08-11T16:55:27+02:00 2016-08-11T16:55:27+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132623#p132623 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>
biass wrote:
Typically if you are paying attention you will make aa before bomber kills you
also, ur acu = buildpower also


i said already, AA cant stop a bomb, atlrough if i make lots of it in front of base. Good countermeasure with giant mass loss.

Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 16:55


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2016-08-11T16:23:57+02:00 2016-08-11T16:23:57+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132615#p132615 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> Statistics: Posted by Mel_Gibson — 11 Aug 2016, 16:23


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2016-08-11T16:20:50+02:00 2016-08-11T16:20:50+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132612#p132612 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> also, ur acu = buildpower also

Statistics: Posted by biass — 11 Aug 2016, 16:20


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2016-08-11T16:24:03+02:00 2016-08-11T16:20:03+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132611#p132611 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> I am not pro gap player but in teamgame at least one player must build t1 inties to stop exactly this kind of bombers.

Your t1 air guy should kill bombers for some time, even if he loses air at least he bought you alot of time.
Early t1 aa hurts eco to much, the later you build it the better. You may even be able to make t2 flack by that time (tho it maybe early for it and t1 aa can do fine too, idk)

Edit: just simple fact of you not having aa or inties/air fac instantly triggers enemy to build some bombers and scouts, even if you loose air when you have 1-5 inties you can shot down bombers, better loose that intie than loose radars and engies (tho not always but I hope you get the point)

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 11 Aug 2016, 16:20


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2016-08-11T16:18:53+02:00 2016-08-11T16:18:53+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132610#p132610 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>
biass wrote:
Quick, a bomber is coming!
How do you react:
A): Make any form of AA and kill the bomber
B): Ping it so a friend who does have some air can kill the bomber
C): Cry on forums

hm


A)no engineers, no buildpower
B)no time or no air players
c) indeed

Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 16:18


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2016-08-11T16:16:49+02:00 2016-08-11T16:16:49+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132609#p132609 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> Quick, a bomber is coming!
How do you react:
A): Make any form of AA and kill the bomber
B): Ping it so a friend who does have some air can kill the bomber
C): Cry on forums

hm

Statistics: Posted by biass — 11 Aug 2016, 16:16


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2016-08-11T16:15:43+02:00 2016-08-11T16:15:43+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132608#p132608 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>
Myxir wrote:
eco when the situation allows it, not when you want to. if you don't invest in defense units/buildings, you can not blame the attacking unit


after i get 4-6 mexes and +150-250 energy income i upgrade to T2 mexes,i still can pause it and go for AA or PD, altrough a bomb wont wait for me to construct an AA and eat my engineers.

Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 16:15


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2016-08-11T16:14:02+02:00 2016-08-11T16:14:02+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132607#p132607 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> Statistics: Posted by Myxir — 11 Aug 2016, 16:14


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2016-08-11T16:14:32+02:00 2016-08-11T16:12:45+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132606#p132606 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 16:12


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2016-08-11T16:02:55+02:00 2016-08-11T16:02:55+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132604#p132604 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>
angus000 wrote:
You must be talking about first bomber. As soon as you see it, you need to make mobile AA and spread out your engies/buildings so as to reduce the damage done by the bomber until you're done killing it. Also, it's always good to make a t1 land scout after your first 2-3 engies to send it at the front lines so you can see any incoming units, be them bombers, labs or tanks, that way you should reduce the damage even further.

Also, "making air is air player's job". That's just wrong. Having your own air factory and/or interceptors is incredibly useful. You shouldn't rely on your air player just to kill an occasional bomber or to scout for you every time you need it. As a general rule, you should always build a t1 air factory to at least make scout unless you are going full land rush.


my landfac buildorder is

1 scout
20 engineers



first bomber is supposted to bomb expanding engineers, i have 2-4 of them, but they can also bomb the ones that leave in base and eco, i dont want to loose 16 engineers just cause didnt made any MAA, MAA is also useless as hell, likely 16 DPS is stupid and maa gets killed easily as engineers, ill make maa next time, stationary maa is times better but still cant cover your base from boms that drops before the plane is taken out.

I also want to get scouts, because all the time i play gap or other "turtle" maps mid players gettin TML or corsair sniped because air players nevermind about scouting, though building 1 airfac and -5 mass eventually is a giant loss to their RAS rush...

Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 16:02


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2016-08-11T11:09:24+02:00 2016-08-11T11:09:24+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132593#p132593 <![CDATA[Re: Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]>
Also, "making air is air player's job". That's just wrong. Having your own air factory and/or interceptors is incredibly useful. You shouldn't rely on your air player just to kill an occasional bomber or to scout for you every time you need it. As a general rule, you should always build a t1 air factory to at least make scout unless you are going full land rush.

Statistics: Posted by angus000 — 11 Aug 2016, 11:09


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2016-08-11T10:00:06+02:00 2016-08-11T10:00:06+02:00 /viewtopic.php?t=12906&p=132592#p132592 <![CDATA[Early bombers, especally sera and aeon]]> Statistics: Posted by Masyaka — 11 Aug 2016, 10:00


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