Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-11-20T21:11:51+02:00

The point is not the damage of the Medusa, but the perma stun you get when you go 1:1 with Rhino:Medusa

Statistics: Posted by Plasma_Wolf — 20 Nov 2018, 21:11

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-11-20T21:00:55+02:00

Well I'm not arguing for Rhino buff, I just wanted to note that it loses to all other tanks, and Medusa isn't exactly the best t1 artie.
Damage of Rhino 25, vs 35 for Ilsie or Pillar, not a huge difference. Obsidians are a bit weird, but Aeons like to rush Harbies anyway.

Statistics: Posted by LabPunk — 20 Nov 2018, 21:00

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-11-20T19:55:15+02:00

Well, Rhinos leave wreckage mass intact (same with their T2 PD) and that is something actually valuable. You get more mass when reclaiming wich gives an interesting advantage

Statistics: Posted by NapSpan — 20 Nov 2018, 19:55

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-11-20T19:06:05+02:00

try sandboxing medusa + rhino against ilshies or obsidians, then you see why you don't need to buff rhino, it could do 0 dmg and would be good in composition with medusas

Statistics: Posted by Platinumizer — 20 Nov 2018, 19:06

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-11-20T18:01:59+02:00

FtXCommando wrote:
So you want a mobile, cheaper T2 PD that is faster than any tank while totally eliminating deceiver micro? Can’t see that being imbalanced.

They were individual suggestions not a package. Besides, PD is tankie with high muzzle velocity, you sneeze on a Hoplite and it falls apart, and its rockets are about as fast as a baseball.
Blaze and Yenzine are faster, and Riptide and Wagner slightly faster.

Statistics: Posted by LabPunk — 20 Nov 2018, 18:01

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-11-20T17:57:09+02:00

Plasma_Wolf wrote:
Aeon is more likely to do a T2 skip because of the strong aurora at T1 and then the harbinger at T3.

I said second more likely

Plasma_Wolf wrote:
Cybran T2 land has the Rhino, which is a very good tank. Not as good as the pillar (that has insane good HP for its mass), but it's a very good tank. Alternatively you can build wagners, which have higher speed and strong alpha damage. Any map with even a small lake makes them very strong.

Both Rhino and Wagner get slaughtered by all other main line T2 tanks. This is fine for the Wagner, which can go under water, but calling the Rhino strong is ridiculous. Sandbox the Rhino mass for mass against Ilsie or Obsidian if you don't believe me.

Plasma_Wolf wrote:
Hoplites are micro intensive, but that's all there is to it. With a deceiver near them, they have higher range than PD have vision range and a single volley from them will kill an aurora.

Cybran has the most options, at any tech. There's almost always a way to make units fit in. While they're not the best at T2 land, they can comfortably play with it.

To an extent yes, but Aurora are also micro intensive, and the Hoplite suffers slow muzzle velocity. I've seen better results against Percivals sometimes than Aurora.
What if Hoplite had vision 28? This would allow them better raiding without affecting their overall combat power.

Statistics: Posted by LabPunk — 20 Nov 2018, 17:57

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-10-09T14:00:03+02:00

Imo range and accuracy increase would be ok. They already rape aurora so that might be an issue on some 5x5, but same thing happens for other factions t1 vs t2 tank...

Maybe slight buff would be interesting if only for seeing them more than once per century.

what about mongoose tho

Statistics: Posted by Blodir — 09 Oct 2018, 14:00

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-10-09T13:25:35+02:00

imho that is a good thing that you can no longer easily just build only hoplites with some stealth and flack...

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 09 Oct 2018, 13:25

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-10-09T09:48:25+02:00

4head

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 09 Oct 2018, 09:48

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-10-09T02:26:37+02:00

LabPunk wrote:
Cybran is the second most likely faction to t2 skip, and I think everyone is fine that Cybran isn't supposed to match UEF or Seraphim in mass equal head on fights.
But Hoplites aren't mainline tanks, and could provide Cybran players with an interesting t2 option.
I know mongooses are typically worse, but UEF already has plenty of t2 power at its disposal.
I'm not asking for a Cybran Buff, just more t2 options in what is supposed to be a diverse faction.
Cybran has the worst or second worst t2 mainline unit, by far the worst t2pd, it would make sense if it had the best t2 raid unit.
A couple of options would be:

-5/10e personal stealth && power +100
-range 37 -> 47 && mass +25 (close to t2 pd, still nowhere near snipers and arty)
-fewer slots on transport like original, to compensate the worst t2 transport
-damage 60 -> 90 && mass +50 (greater health/ damage disparity to increase the raid nature)

Hoplites are absolute god tier. I almost never build rhinos or wagners. I nearly always pump out 4-6 hoplites with stealth and flak and hilariously stomp large T1 armies with them. They require good micro and have to be baby-sat but if you're willing to do it hoplites are probably the single best T2 unit in the game.

Statistics: Posted by moses_the_red — 09 Oct 2018, 02:26

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-08-04T20:30:34+02:00

Hoplites are fine.
Rhinos on the other hands are garbage.

Statistics: Posted by Sovietpride — 04 Aug 2018, 20:30

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-07-26T01:13:30+02:00

Hoplites own

Statistics: Posted by Mountain — 26 Jul 2018, 01:13

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-07-26T00:39:07+02:00

Farmsletje wrote:
aeon t2 > cybran t2

Depends: if it's a giant open field like open palms hoplites will eat obsidians for breakfast. I will equal mass fight as hoplites verse your equal mass obs on that map and beat you any day. Accept challenge now.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 26 Jul 2018, 00:39

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-07-25T22:22:51+02:00

aeon t2 > cybran t2

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 25 Jul 2018, 22:22

Re: Make Hoplites more useful

2018-07-25T22:15:35+02:00

units with high range can scale and snowball much better with higher numbers. in 3599 hoplites had only one difference from current hoplites... (as far as i remember)
They had 650 HP, and t2 tanks were not as strong... cybran would make hoplites all day and by the time other guy makes t3 - cybran might have ~40 hoplites that outrange many t3 units and can even one-shot them, hoplites just need to have some weakness preventing people from spamming to many of them... maybe right now they are bit too weak... would not recommend making more than 20 of them xD.... imho that is fine...

Statistics: Posted by ZLO_RD — 25 Jul 2018, 22:15