Forged Alliance Forever

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-05T16:41:19+02:00

i like it.

need ui mod for auto hold fire tho

Statistics: Posted by Blodir — 05 Nov 2018, 16:41

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T11:57:27+02:00

IMO Fire beetle should have cloak.

Basicly you should just mix one or two and a bunch of moles in unit mix. If you have stealth, enemy wouldn't be able to see any Fire beetle until it is too late, If there is no stealth, enemy would see a bunch of dots on radar including mole-fakes.

It should do any reasonable damage itself(unless on really small area), but stun all units exept T4: T3/ACU - 4 sec, T2 - 8 sec, T1 - 12 sec. This way you'd be able to do more damage on static target with some Arty or MMLs

Statistics: Posted by Apofenas — 02 Nov 2018, 11:57

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T04:47:17+02:00

SpoCk0nd0pe wrote:
I think its a cool idea!

If you set them to auto detonate, it could be difficult to balance them. Either they are useless because they wouldn't be mass efficient or they can only be countered by the ACU until you hit T3.

More opportunity for unit play is exactly what this game needs imho.

Bear in mind that the effectiveness of a single or low number of mines goes down if the enemy is moving cautiously or has very powerful units. The bombs will uncloak when they move to attack, giving the enemy units a split-second to react and fire. Some are still gonna die though

Statistics: Posted by IceDreamer — 02 Nov 2018, 04:47

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T04:38:19+02:00

I think its a cool idea!

If you set them to auto detonate, it could be difficult to balance them. Either they are useless because they wouldn't be mass efficient or they can only be countered by the ACU until you hit T3.

More opportunity for unit play is exactly what this game needs imho.

Statistics: Posted by SpoCk0nd0pe — 02 Nov 2018, 04:38

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T04:41:57+02:00

Apofenas wrote:
From what i can see in PR, this also removes that cloak from Selen. Does that mean you'll give it proper turn rate to shoot while moving?

The Selen should be completely unaffected. Changes made should be a non-functional refactor, purely to avoid duplicating code. Any changes to Selen behavior should be noted and I will fix them.

JoonasTo wrote:
This seems weird. We’ve been all about removing micro and now we’re adding something that has to be manually detonated?

Shouldn’t the unit have some kind of auto function? So you can just lay these in out of the way locations to deny runbys and drops and such. Won’t work against main army anyway because commander has omni.

That said, I think the energy cost is too expensive. These are units that show up in the t1 power phase so more than 20 power seems excessive.

Absolutely not. It does not have to be manually detonated. It will explode: When killed by enemy fire, when the detonate button is used, when instant or non-instant ctrl-k is used. It will detect enemy units that come into a close-ish range of the detonation radius (Double, I think, the numbers are alpha and unlikely to be 'correct' first time), and will automatically target, uncloak, close in on, and detonate.

EDIT:
Numbers - The initial numbers I pulled out of my butt are increased AOE from 6 to 8, MaxRadius from 5.8 to 7.8 (Must be slightly smaller than AOE, to ensure something is in AOE when we blow ourselves up), and a "I see an enemy, I'm going to wake up, scuttle over there, and blow up in his face!" radius of 15.6 (double the AOE).

Beetles are fast, but the decision to make them wake up (revealing themselves) and move to the enemy was based on game design principles I'll be happy to go into if you wish. PM, chat, or some kind of write-up if you reeeally want it lol.
END EDIT

It is designed to act entirely as you describe in second paragraph.

Energy cost is, like the ranges etc, just an initial number. This is proof of concept, not a final proposal.

angus000 wrote:
Can you make it so it only auto-detonates if the sum of the mass of the units that will be killed is greater than that of the beetle?

Technically yes, but I have several reasons for believing this would be a poor game design decision. The present concept is meant to be as easy to use in most situations as possible by the 99% players who aren't "good". If you're concerned about wasting a blast, that's where the more advanced micro features come in. They are there for people like you, for use in those situations when needed.

Thank you to Keyser for making this thread, and to all participants for keeping it on topic, civil, and taking the proposal seriously.

PS - Keyser's video demonstrated the very worst way to detonate when you're using manual control, all that changing fire-modes. It's a lot of clicking. Instead, you can use the detonate button, ctrl-k, or insta-ctrl-k, even when the weapon is set to hold fire, and they still go boom. Even better, if the enemy has Omni and can see them, they will even blow up when killed by enemy fire, despite being hold fire! Designed to be very easy to use, very hard to waste

Statistics: Posted by IceDreamer — 02 Nov 2018, 04:31

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T01:40:30+02:00

ZeRen wrote:
Farmsletje wrote:Maybe he means widow mines

nope, widow mines, fire "missile" and recharge for next shot, they can shot air and burrow under ground, so no rip off

I know what they do?

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 02 Nov 2018, 01:40

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T01:36:30+02:00

Just give me old beetles back, I don't care about Cyb being weak on defense, I just want their drops to be useful again

Statistics: Posted by Wesmania — 02 Nov 2018, 01:36

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-02T00:02:30+02:00

angus000 wrote:
Can you make it so it only auto-detonates if the sum of the mass of the units that will be killed is greater than that of the beetle?

If it doesn't kill anything but severely damages a cluster of t2 then it will have paid for itself.

Statistics: Posted by Evan_ — 02 Nov 2018, 00:02

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T22:13:08+02:00

keyser wrote:
#Banelings

ah burrow banneling, yea that is a mine

Statistics: Posted by ZeRen — 01 Nov 2018, 22:13

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T22:10:02+02:00

#Banelings

Statistics: Posted by keyser — 01 Nov 2018, 22:10

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T22:07:29+02:00

Farmsletje wrote:
Maybe he means widow mines

nope, widow mines, fire "missile" and recharge for next shot, they can shot air and burrow under ground, so no rip off

Statistics: Posted by ZeRen — 01 Nov 2018, 22:07

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T21:19:59+02:00

If StarCraft 2 is a terrific game then Le Pen is a great prime minister for France.

Statistics: Posted by Morax — 01 Nov 2018, 21:19

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T21:05:05+02:00

Can you make it so it only auto-detonates if the sum of the mass of the units that will be killed is greater than that of the beetle?

Statistics: Posted by angus000 — 01 Nov 2018, 21:05

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T20:35:53+02:00

Maybe he means widow mines

Statistics: Posted by Farmsletje — 01 Nov 2018, 20:35

Re: Another Balance thread !

2018-11-01T20:33:09+02:00

Morax wrote:
This is a complete RIP-off of the starcraft spider mine.

Please don't mimic anything starcraft 2..

There is plenty to mimic from Star2, it's a terrific game. Hotkeying control groups for one.

But this has nothing to do with Star2 or StarCraft(spider mines are from StarCraft, not Star2.) Spider mines auto-detonate, cannot be set to hold fire, are basically free(or vultures are, kekeke) and need to be laid from a vehicle.

Statistics: Posted by JoonasTo — 01 Nov 2018, 20:33