Required changes in 3610

[Karottenrambo]

Which changes do we need to make armma, pavese and pretty much everyone(except uber) happy again in 3610?

- small t2 gunships nerf
- removing radar from t1 bomber and add it to scout
- decrease Mercy range(NOT FUEL)
*- Improve t1 mobile aa
- Titan buff(?)
*- shield interruption script
*- fix that battleships cant shot subs anymore
*- Corsair fix
*- SMS missile buff
*- t2/t3 engi bp buff

What else?

*changed

[FunkOff]

Which changes do we need to make armma, pavese and pretty much everyone(except uber) happy again in 3610?

- small t2 gunships nerf
- removing radar from t1 bomber and add it to scout
- decrease Mercy range(NOT FUEL)
- Improve t1 mobile aa state from "useless garbage" to "shitty unit"
- Titan buff(?)


What else?

Nobody has suggested giving the mercy less fuel, lol. Also, the T1 AA is not a "useless garbage" or even bad. It's actually a very capable unit. It's primary strengths are low build time and low cost, so you're expected to have a whole bunch of them. I've never see a tech 2 gunship take out 8 or more of them at once.

I like the shield interruption script and think it should be included as well.

Further, I'm working on a fix for battleships being able to kill subs. I'll try and make them unable to kill subs and, in their stead, I'll be making destroyers more effective at it. This is a change that should probably make it into 3610. Same with SMS sub weapons.

Quantum gate teleportation? Maybe that can wait :-p
But the Corsair fix should go in there, as well as a few light seraphim buffs, one of which is buffing the useless regen aura upgrade.

Engineer buffs should also be included just to make things more even super-late game (T1 engie spam makes seraphim and aeon not viable in turtle/sim city matches).

That should cover the core, necessary changes.

[noobymcnoobcake]

Genral
-battleships cant shoot subs
-repairs cost 1/4 mass buildtime price of building the unit so it actualy makes senese to repair ships or experementals.

-All factions units
-land
-T3 artillery mass cost 800-600 - cost is better invested into percivals unless position is very heavily defended.
-T3 sniper bots mass cost 800-600. never see them used
- mobile T1 AA - funkOffs idea :I'd rather just make mobile AA like tanks... cost the same and do the same dps. That would be a change from 36 mass to 50, and a change from 16 dps to 24.
-SCUS need massive cost and builtime decrease. Prehaps as somebody said have ones you get pre upgraded at the gate when you buy one. Combat or Engineer.
-land experementals build time increased by 50%
-structure
-T2 flack 20% dps increase? its still on of those units you should never build It only got like 4 dps more than mobile flack and 44 range instead of 40 but cost over 2x as much.
-T2 artilley cost -20%, double rof and half damage. At the moment there is no real counter at T2 to a PD on a chokepoint. MMls are easily beaten by TMD unless enemy is UEF and you are cybran, once they got 5 or so flack no chance in T2 gunships/bommbers working and pds are very good against frontal charge. T2 arty reloads slower than T2 shields recharge. you are better off investing mass into T3 fac and T3 arty. Also increase there splash to that of there T3 mobile counterparts. The cybran one would be great way to deal with a T1 swarm sitting out of range of your PDs.

Give it tracking and much faster turning speed. This would make it more effective vs ships or other moving units. at the moment it takes around 30 secs for it to move 180 degrees. This tracking ability might still make it usefull at T3 stage when you got acess to T3 mobile arty.
-massfabs
T2 fabs upkeep 150-120
T3 fabs upkeep 3500-3000
T3 fabs all build cost -20%
T2 fabs hp 360-600. the death explosion does 370 damage but has an AOE of 5. this means you need to kill two mass fabs to start a chain reaction not just one
T2 fabs buildtime 500-250

-Air
-Transports beam up units from longer range and drop them faster. Making the faster and easier to use might make people use them more.
-T2 gunships E cost +30%, hp - 20%
-Naval
-give carrier anti nukes? and possible better AA?
-all air units 5 min fueltime exept transports and mercys

-seraphim
-T2 units
- torpedo launcher hp 4800-5800
- Mr Pinguin great idea. My 'solution' was to make the Yenzyne into a mid-ranged sniper tank. I never got around to testing this, but my plan was to give it slightly shorter range than the kite bots (e.g., ~30), and then tweak the DPS and RoF. T2 hover tanks are fast, which makes them a decent counter vs kite bots, but the risk with a longer-ranged Yenzyne is that it could get OP'd if it was too good at kiting other T2/T1 units, especially since it could harass from the sea (like Auroras and Fobos).
-If people dont like Mr Pinguins idea then yenzyne needs fixing badly.
-Destroyer - more beam and torpedo DPS. the worst of them at the moment as they also dont have T2 sub/anti sub ship.
-fix topedo bommber sucking by making its torpedos not anti torp interceptable and make them work in shallow water
-Sera T2 fighter/bommber needs changing a bit. Janus is far better in every way (at bommbing, sniping ACUS, fighting inties, killing large groups, hitting stuff)
-Cybran
-T1
-medusa and lobo cost swap. Medusa is the worst T1 arty by a long way but also the most expensive
-T2
-make hoplight take up a T1 transport slot again. The cybran transports suck and stealth drops are the cybran way of fighting
-T3
- brick walks funny. If anyone could do a new animation to it it would be great. At the moment it just looks stupid. This is not a bugfix but something that bugs me
-UEF
-T1
-Lobo and medusa cost swap
-T2
-UEF TMD needs fixing. It is worse than the other factions in every situation. Also cant shoot ACU TMLs as they are too high for it bug other factions TMD can
-T4 novax cost decrease and give it much bigger view range.
-Aeon
-T2
-make aeon T2 shield upgradable into the T3 one like all other factions shields
-reduce destoyer and T2 pds charge up time for main gun. The desoyer is good on paper but wont hit anything if its been microed well. HP nerf for destoyer might be needed because of this.
-T3
-Absolver anti shield range 60-80. At the moment it is outranged my ravages and mmls. With this change it will have the same range as the UEF anti shield spearhead.
-T4
-Temptest hp 35000-60000 as funkoff said would be good change. At the moment it loses to summit class(9k mass) and it cost 28k mass. It will still be OWNED mass for mass by battleships even with this change just not quite as much.

[Karottenrambo]

The title is "Required changes in 3610", not "Required changes until 3700"

[noobymcnoobcake]

-T3 artillery mass cost 800-600 - cost is better invested into percivals unless position is very heavily defended.
-T3 sniper bots mass cost 800-600. never see them used
-absolver range 60-80 (same as spearhead)
-T2 gunships E cost +30%, hp - 20%
-T2 artilley cost -20%, double rof and half damage increase turning speed too and give tracking
-Yenzyne range +10, rof +100% damage -50%

I think these are the most imortant changes from my list

Why no absolver buff? i dont think anybody can think of a reason to oppose it. Can you? its the simple cure to massed ravages and stacked shields.

[Armmagedon]

-T3 artillery mass cost 800-600 - cost is better invested into percivals unless position is very heavily defended.
-T3 sniper bots mass cost 800-600. never see them used
-absolver range 60-80 (same as spearhead)
-T2 gunships E cost +30%, hp - 20%
-T2 artilley cost -20%, double rof and half damage increase turning speed too and give tracking
-Yenzyne range +10, rof +100% damage -50%

I think these are the most imortant changes from my list

Why no absolver buff? i dont think anybody can think of a reason to oppose it. Can you? its the simple cure to massed ravages and stacked shields.

man i think that you all want change many things without think on them sufficient,
noomycake i will use your post cause you was the last but i could do the same with the others.

t3 arty are useful like is now, and i saw many sniper bots in many games they dont need a buff, absolver is a really good unit vs shield, i use them every time that i play aeon, i agree with the t2 gunships nerf, at least you want nerf them

t2 artillery was buffed on 3603, dont buff more them man, if ppl dont use them too much is cause they never used after, but is a good unit for camping base if you could spam t2 artys why you should build t2 pds,
really i hate t2 pds and t2 artys lol.

someone tested yenzines vs riptides?
i think that at same cost yenzines can pwn riptides they are the 2 biggest shitty t2 units, if you want buff yenzine should buff riptides too, if dont believe me, compare hp/cost and dps/cost on database

[FunkOff]

*- fix that battleships cant shot subs anymore

I think a necessary change to go along with this is to make destroyers better vs subs. After all, if battleships can't kill groups of subs anymore, what will? It should be destroyers.

[Treble]

-T3 sniper bots mass cost 800-600. never see them used

Just a random thought. Instead of a mass decrease what if they were allowed to target air? The projectile is fast enough.

Also, I think boost sparky speed. Maybe 4, as fast as a Titan! Means you can get to those wrecks fast.

[Mr Pinguin]

-T3 artillery mass cost 800-600 - cost is better invested into percivals unless position is very heavily defended.
-T3 sniper bots mass cost 800-600. never see them used
-absolver range 60-80 (same as spearhead)

I have a different view on the T3 arty (as I've posted elsewhere, I think a range increase + minimum range + DPS increase + speed nerf gives them a better defined niche. A cost-decrease buff does increase their cost-effectiveness, but their role is still a bit fuzzy in my view and arty like the Trebuchet is, unfortunately, most effective on its last shots at point-blank range).

More importantly though, I don't think the T3 sniper bots need a lower cost.

The Usha-Ah is already balanced for cost vs the slowest units (Percivals and Bricks), plus its DPS is much better than T3 arty, making it semi-useful for attacking defenses and trying to snipe sensitive targets.

The Sprite striker is awful, but there are a lot of subtle reasons for that. Even if you give it a cost decrease, it really needs other changes imo.
I won't go into a full explanation here, but here are my suggested changes to bring it up to par with the Usha-Ah.

Code: Select all

xal0305 Sprite Striker, Aeon Sniper bot
   Damage = 2400, #now 144DPS--was 130 DPS #1300, now just over the Usha-ah
   RateOfFire = 0.06, #now 16.6sec, was #0.1 10sec,
   TrackingRadius = 1.35, #1.15, #hoping this will get it to deploy sooner?
   TurretPitchSpeed = 45, #30,#needed buff so it can swing 180 faster
   WeaponUnpackAnimationRate = 1.5, #1, #buffed so it can fire sooner

I've tested this, and with these stats the Sprite Striker is just barely able to beat its cost in advancing Percivals (but only with careful micro). It's still of limited use vs advancing Monkeylords and it completely loses to its cost in advancing Titans/Loyalists, but I think that's ok.

[lebensnebel]

Everybody is on the patch train naow? When did the no-patch train leave?

Still to early in my opinion. Energy storage is still enough to scare alot of people away....